With the blessing of the originator, I was encouraged via PM to introduce a new thread discussing this subject.
In a previous thread, I incorrectly used the word "send" when specifying that incorrect doctrine or doctrinal error can result in souls being misled, with the end result being those souls go to hell.
I believe in salvation by grace through faith; not of works. Anyone who teaches salvation by grace plus anything; salvation by any means other than Jesus; etc.; is teaching false doctrine. Those that follow that false doctrine will find themselves in hell.
This is what I meant. Please feel free to educate me further on the subject.
Incorrect/Correct Doctrine
Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Don, Dec 8, 2010.
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It's as I said on the other thread; I didn't have anything to do with my own eternal destiny, far much less anyone else's. -
I humbly submit the parable of the talents; hopefully, I'm not using it out of context.
But I'm not grasping exactly what your opposition to my statement is. If someone teaches something other than salvation by grace, are they not leading someone astray? -
I wonder why, when Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for proselytizing, he said those they converted were "twofold more the children of hell?" Matthew 23:15
I've not studied it out. -
If God's election is unconditional and grace is irresistable. Then any action on one's part plays not part in anyone's standing before God. Prayer, Witnessing, teaching, or preaching are all mute points
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If you had nothing to do with your eternal destiny, the reprobate also had nothing to do with their eternal destiny. Therefore they are erroneously held accountable for something they had nothing to do with. -
Hello Don
Even though I am not a Calvinist I agree, that we don’t have very much to do with a person going to hell.
All those souls that follow a false prophet, choose to do so themselves.
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But there is one area where our sin, can be responsible for the actions of others.
When we(as pastors), are told to preach the truth to our flock.....
Ezekiel 3:18
“When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked [man] shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.”
This is talking about pastors, having the courage to warn God’s people(from the pulpit), to repent of their sinful practices.
If he doesn’t, and they are chastened to death(taken on home to be with the Lord early), their blood will be on his hands. -
God holds man responsible for our actions. This has nothing to do, of course, with the eternal purposes of God
Greatest example is the crucifixion. 100% God's will, God's plan, God's orchestrating events culminating in deicide.
So God is blamed? No way, Hosea!!
They acted on their own depraved vile will, BUT "against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, for to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done" it was God's plan/will.
And as to blame/accountability? "Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead" = 100% on the evil doers
(Both part of the sermon in Acts 4) -
Hmmmm, seems like a pretty clear determination to me.
What am I missing?
I think there is a big smoke screen every time someone used the term "hyper calvinism." What does that actually mean? -
But I have to ask: for those people without a pastor, that see only little ol' you and me -- do we have no responsibility to warn others of impending damnation? -
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I think we are held accountable for our behavior and the lost are held accountable for theirs.
If I hide my light under a bushel, I will lose reward but not salvation.
The Bible is clear that God has revealed Himself to all men, so that they are without excuse. Their condemnation is on their own head. -
However, I think you're also saying we will have to answer for ourselves for preaching a false doctrine. Is that correct? -
If a person is truly a child of God, He will not let him continue in false teaching. He will be chastised if necessary or taken out of the ministry. -
I agree that we'll each answer for ourselves. As I read through each of these posts, I continue to work through this subject. Amy, your posts have caused me to ask: Is there a greater condemnation for those that convince others of a false gospel?
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Bro. James Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Hyper-calvinism: those who have the most petals on their tulip. Many folk have trouble with the first: total depravity--some think our depravity does not include the free will, others believe the will is enslaved to the depraved nature and unable to choose wisely. This is the basic issue between J. Arminius and J. Calvin. There are also a lot of variations since their day. Irresistible grace is also a bone of contention.
Millions have perished, never having heard the Gospel. This makes no sense if God is not totally sovereign--limited atonement.
Selah,
Bro. James -
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Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
We are responsible to warn the wicked faithfully,but even that result is in God's hand. This section of scripture used by Paul in acts 18 figures into the discussion;
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If you're using the above passage to imply that Christians who fail to make converts are also going to burn in hell, yes, you've grossly taken it out of context. I suggest to you that the Jews, as a whole, have been 'cast into the outer darkness where there is the weeping and the gnashing of teeth' for the last two millenia for their disobedience [not eternity in hell but in this time world], and that the true implication of the passage concerning the unprofitable servant was to 'cut him asunder, and appoint his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be the weeping and the gnashing of teeth'. If you reject the 'preterist modifier' in your interpretation of the gospels, then no, you won't grasp this.
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