The bible never says God only draws the chosen because all are chosen when He died for the sins of the world. Being chosen does not mean we will be saved no matter what. Other wise being chosen would be in effect Salvation and we would not be born in sin. We would be born saved.. This is the insanity of Calvinism. It's the doctrine of men. My advice; drop the Calvinism for the doctrine of Christ. The way you are now you are just plain confused
MB
John 12:32 in context
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by MB, Mar 11, 2019.
Page 7 of 9
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
What is it you think you have proved. That the Bible is wrong and you are right Jn.12:32 still says Christ draws all. All is all inclusive just as I said from the beginning.
MB -
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
Can you not prove it? Take the case of a person of integrity, candor and intelligence. Can I prove men of flesh understand spiritual milk? Yes, just read 1 Corinthians 3:1. But could it be proved to someone else denying the verse means what it says, and claiming it means the opposite? That would be a tough row to hoe.
-
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
tyndale1946 Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Revelation 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
7:10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. -
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
Show scripture for you opinion. There is none. So where do you get that from? You get it from the false doctrine of Calvinism The Bible does not say only some will be drawn or chosen.Even this below according to you is not in context unless I post the whole Bible But John says.
in JN 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God..
Take scripture for what it says or don't.
You have no proof only some are chosen or drawn.
MB -
MB -
MB -
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
-
Reformed1689 Well-Known Member
-
Obfuscation from your point of view, I'll grant that, sir.
The what? "deflection"?
Admittedly, I had to change my mental association mode from physics / ballistics to conversational "deflection" in order to get where you're coming from...but now I understand what you're saying..."avoiding the point of".
"Metaphorical meaning of draw"?
What's metaphorical about the word, "draw"?
Draw means "to attract".
The Koine Greek in John 6:44 is the word, "ἑλκύσῃ" , which is transliterated as " helkó" or " elkusē", which literally means to "drag".
Strong's Greek: 1670. ἑλκύω (helkó) -- to drag
So I have no idea where you're getting your information, except outside of anything biblically associative.
I also notice that you are referencing Plato, Phaedra ( a Greek tragedy based on mythology ), Aelian ( Claudius Aelianus, a Roman teacher of rhetoric, ca. 175-235 A.D. ), false Scripture like Maccabees, Vergil ( Virgil, or Publius Vergilius Maro, ancient Roman poet ) and the only "Cf. Meyer" that I know of was Conrad Ferdinand Meyer, a Swiss poet...none of which ever professed Christ or had anything to do with Scriptural teaching...They were all secular teachers of man-made philosophy.
Question:
Am I reading the above correctly?
If so, my next question is this...
Are you a born-again believer in Jesus Christ, the Son of the living God?
If so, how is it that you seem to value an unbeliever's explanations of concepts about the Bible?
http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/NTpdf/joh6.pdf
http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/NTpdf/joh12.pdf
Page 7 of 9