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Featured Murder in The Bible

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by SavedByGrace, Oct 18, 2020.

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  1. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Murder in the Holy Bible is a very serious crime, which is the unlawful, deliberate, taking of another human life. Because humans have been created in the "Image of God", it is one of the highest crimes against the Lord, and other humans. The Bible's punishment for murder, has been from the Book of Genesis, to Revelation, death. The passage in Revalation show the seriousness of this crime, and its punishment is, "the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death”, which is a far more severe punishment than the death penalty, that humans are to administer on behalf of the Lord. There is no evidence anywhere in the Bible (unless I have missed it), where murder is punishable by anything less than death.

    Rather than posting our own personal views, or, what we think what the Bible should say, I would like to see from the Scriptures, if there is any reason why this high crime, should not be punished by death.

    Genesis 9:6, "Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man."

    Exodus 24:14, "But if a man acts with premeditation against his neighbor, to kill him by treachery, you shall take him from My altar, that he may die"

    Leviticus 21:17, “Whoever takes a human life shall surely be put to death."

    Numbers 35:20-21, " And if he pushed him out of hatred or hurled something at him, lying in wait, so that he died, or in enmity struck him down with his hand, so that he died, then he who struck the blow shall be put to death. He is a murderer. The avenger of blood shall put the murderer to death when he meets him"

    Numbers 35:31, “Moreover, you shall accept no ransom for the life of a murderer, who is guilty of death, but he shall be put to death

    Matthew 5:21-22, “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder, and whoever murders will be in danger of the punishment.’ Moreover, I say to you that whoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the punishment. And whoever says to his brother, ‘Raca!’ shall be in danger of the council. But whoever says, ‘You fool!’ shall be in danger of hell fire. .”

    Revelation 21:8, "But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
     
  2. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Judges 4:22 But Jael, Heber’s wife, took a tent peg and seized a hammer in her hand, and went secretly to him and drove the peg into his temple, and it went through into the ground; for he was sound asleep and exhausted. So he died.
     
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  3. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    thanks for the passage, is there a reason why you quote it?
     
  4. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    You mean other than the obvious point that all killing is not murder?
     
  5. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    the OP is showing that murder is punishable by death in the Bible, because there are some who hold that this punishment is not taught in the Bible
     
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  6. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Revelation 21:8, "But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

    Interesting that you don’t hear any sermons on the damnation of the cowardly.
     
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  7. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    maybe because the Greek δειλός, also has the meaning "vile, worthless"; but the KJV reads, "fearful". At the end of Hebrews chapter 10, we read of those who "shrink back". It can also read "cowardly". so ytou can take your pick on which word should go here in 21:8
     
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  8. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Just pushing the envelope...

    Then there is Jephthah’s daughter (Judges 11) ... murder for sacrifice

    How about David’s murder of Uriah the Hittite (2 Samuel 11) ... murder by proxy

    Jacob’s sons’ Simeon and Levi murdered a whole town (Genesis 34)... murder for revenge

    Rob
     
  9. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    the just penalty for murder as prescribed in the Bible, is death. However, God, being God, and without any restraints as The Lawmaker, does as He will. He can order the killing of some, and pardon others. Taking David for example, God in His Infinite mercy chose not to apply the death penalty to David's "proxy murder". However, we are Bible-bound to follow His Word, even when our own personal beliefs might not agree. God IS The Ultimate Righteous Judge.
     
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  10. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    So as long as God does it I’m okay with it too.
    Just don’t make me decide to pull the switch.
    I’ll err on the side of mercy

    Rob
     
  11. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    God has given the implementation of the death penalty to governments (ROM 13) not individuals.

    The apostle Paul says in 1 Tim 1:15-16, that he was the worst of sinners (he persecuted Christians to the death: Paul was a murderer) and that Jesus Christ demonstrated mercy toward him as an example to be followed by future Christians. We are to show mercy to the worst of sinners, even murderers.

    Following these passages of scripture, I believe Christians should not support the death penalty.
     
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  12. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    so we are just to ignore all the passages that I have quoted in the OP, from both the Old and New Testaments? People like David and Paul, were directly forgiven by the Lord, Who can do as He will. However, the Bible is very clear that murder is punishable by death. If, as you say, "I believe Christians should not support the death penalty", then I suppose you are against what the Bible says in Revelation 21:8, which is the worst form of punishment for murders? Our "opinions" based on public sentiments and what this wicked world says, has no bearing on what the Infallible Word of God actually says!
     
  13. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Me neither. But surely we have to obey the Word of God even when we might disagree with, or find it hard to follow?
     
  14. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    I don’t think Christians are ever COMMANDED by God to personally and individually kill someone. It would seem to fall into the “All things are lawful, but not all things edify.” So a Christian may kill an intruder to defend his life/family (lawful) and a Christian may be a “conscientious objector” (edify).
     
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  15. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Then you should follow the command of God given to us by the Apostle Paul; that is... Paul was a murderer. He specifically says God demonstrated mercy toward him as an example to be followed by future believers.

    peace to you
     
  16. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    I don’t ignore those passages. God has established the death penalty to be implemented by governments. God often used the ungodly, both OT and NT, to accomplish His will.

    Christians are called to be different. Christians are commanded to show mercy to the worst of sinners, even as God showed mercy to the murder Paul.

    peace to you
     
  17. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    "gospel" according to Candy! :Rolleyes
     
  18. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    I urged you to start this thread to discuss the death penalty and promised to post my views. I have done that without attacking you at all.

    You cannot address the scripture I mentioned commanding believers to follow the example of God when He demonstrated mercy to the murderer, Paul, so you resort to personal attacks.

    If you want to address this issue, I’ll participate. If you want use personal attacks instead of addressing the scripture I mentioned, then I’ll let you “debate” someone else.

    Thanks for the conversation.

    peace to you
     
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  19. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. Romans 13:3-4

    I don't live in ancient Israel. I live in America. I won't fault a Christian for supporting the death penalty, being a judge and sentencing someone to death, or sitting on a jury for a capital crime. These are things that unfortunately must occur to keep society running.

    But as a Christian, I am commanded to forgive. God may ordain the secular authorities to act, but He may also break them and throw them aside. Vengeance belongs to the Lord.
     
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  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    your reasoning is human-minded and very faulty. Lets take your reasoning to another issue, adultery. In John chapter 8 we have the famous account of the woman caught in the act of adultery, Jesus says to her, "Neither do I condemn thee: go thy way; from henceforth sin no more" (8:11). So, because of this account are we to conclude at all acts of adultery are not to be "condemned"?
     
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