It would be amusing if it were not so sad and hypocritical to see the party of NO now decrying the same tactic they used during the Bush administration.
Reconciliation of Health Care is First Step Toward Dictatorship
Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by righteousdude2, Mar 12, 2010.
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Reconciliation is not the way to pass a bill as sweeping as the health-care bill.
2 vote(s)14.3% -
Obama is using dictator like tactics to force the Dem's to vote his way.
6 vote(s)42.9% -
This bill needs a bi-partisan vote to truly reflect this democracy and its people.
2 vote(s)14.3% -
Reconciliation should be stopped and never again used to pass any bill or budget.
1 vote(s)7.1% -
Obama and Dem's will face political suicide for using reconciliation.
3 vote(s)21.4%
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Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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To put it briefly, I know, because they explicitly said so. Below you will find quotes from some of our most important and respected Founding Fathers. They were unambiguous as to their sentiments regarding "democracy."
And just in case you're jumping to conclusions (which you may not be at all...if not, my apologies): In no way am I saying that our Founding Fathers weren't proponents of liberty. Rather, I'm saying they were in no way fans of a Democracy. They wished to set up a Republic. "Democracy" was viewed as "mob rule." Some quotes, better said than I manage to:
From Neal Boortz: SOURCE
Other views by Founding Fathers on democracy SOURCE:
- John Winthrop, whose "City on a Hill" inspired President Ronald Reagan, declared that "among civil nation a democracy is accounted the meanest and worst of all forms of government."
- John Adams: "Remember democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes and murders itself. There never was democracy yet that did not commit suicide."
- Thomas Jefferson: "A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where 51 percent of the people may take away the rights of the other 49."
Oh, and you might want to apologize to MP for confusing us. He's probably spitting mad about it by now. :eek: :D :laugh: -
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...But are you opposed the reconciliation process? -
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Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Why didn't they say NO why did they not say NO when G. Bush took a budget surplus and turn it into a deficit, and a growing one at that? Hypocrits is what they are. -
Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
I thought Congress ran on a majority vote. Maybe reconciliation is not a great idea. The Republicans used it when they were in power and we now that put us in a very bad way.
However, now the Republicians want to deny the used of it to ram through G. Bush's policies. Now they say they do not want it so they can say NO to everything.
Seems a real bag of worms. -
Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
O. Hatch, who has been critical of Obama and reconciliation voted for reconciliation every time it came up during the Bush years.
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Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Hate and anger are negative emotions that do no good. They only harm the holder of the emotions. Calm rational thought and observation is much better. I -
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Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
This was an avoidable problem, but politicians did not have the gumption to do what was needed. Political points took precedence over the needs of the nation.
To me this is being continued with a vengeance by the party of NO.
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I do agree with one of your points. We as Americans seem to have lost our foresight to save or invest. There is no thought given to the future, only instant gratification. -
Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
The money should have been invested, say in state municipal bonds or in high grade corporate bonds. If I believed a really competent person would have been placed in charge of the investments stocks would have been alright. However that would have brought conflict of interest. The government would have slanted rules and regulations to their favor at the expense of the market and people.
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I had to look up reconciliation to find out what it is. Everywhere I looked, it said it is used for the Budget. Although the early predictions are that the healthcare bill will dominate 1/6 of the budget, it is supposed to be about health care.
One very real concern is the "strong arm" tactics that are reportedly being used to coerce elected congress members to vote for this bill. It was a problem when GWB used it to get CAFTA, and it is a problem now.
PS One congressman that caved to the pressure and voted for CAFTA is now UNEMPLOYED. -
Man, I bet you get disappointed when someone with whom you disagree is consistent in your view. Does it make you feel guilty? -
Crabtownboy Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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This is the problem with partisan politics. "Well the Republicans used it so..." Well gues what? The Republicans were wrong for using it. The Dems are now wrong for using it. Just because one side does something doesn't mean it's ok for everyone to do it. Like my mom used to say, "if so and so jumps off a bridge, will you do it too." Two wrongs don't make a right. This is not the way to pass anything, much less something as big as this bill. It is a cheap tactic used by sleazy politicians to pass something people don't want.
I absolutely despise the "well the Republicans did it" argument. Not only is that a moronic argument is the first place, it is also played out. We are supposed to be Christians. Christians are supposed to believe in living by a higher standard no matter what everyone else is doing. We should hold our politicians to these standards. The fact is both sides are corrupt, immoral, and unethical and both sides have been destroying this country for quite some time.
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