None of the people in this Topic were saved when Paul wrote those words.
Individually, I'm as saved as I can get; you (who are saved) are as saved as you can get. Collectively ('we', 'us'), as a group, we ARE BEING SAVED. Even today, not all that will be saved are already saved, they are still lost. If the Lord tarries, more shall be saved.
I believe the following:
All valid English Versions
individually and collectively
contain and are the inerrant,
Divinely Preserved
Written Word of God, the Holy Bible.
Saved or Being Saved
Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Lukasaurus, Sep 3, 2008.
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Sharp contrast to those that are perishing and same construction with the articular participle. No reason for the change of pronouns in English. This present passive participle is again timeless. Salvation is described by Paul as a thing done in the past, "we were saved" (Romans 8:24), as a present state, "ye have been saved" (2:5), as a process, "ye are being saved" (1 Corinthians 15:2), as a future result, "thou shalt be saved" (Romans 10:9 ).The English Present Progressive Tense can be active (verb with -ing ending) or passive (usually "being" plus verb with -ed ending). The Present Perfect Progressive Tense is used to express duration of an action that began in the past, includes the present, and may continue into the future. Jamieson, Fausset, Brown state that --
them that perish--rather, "them that are perishing," namely, by preferring human "wisdom of words" to the doctrine of the "cross of Christ." It is not the final state that is referred to; but, "them that are in the way of perishing." So also in 2 Corinthians 2:15,16.It is possible to interprete Paul as describing two classes (categories) of people in all three of the example verses (notice all plural forms "them", "us", "ye" and "we"): the faithful, and the foolish. His two groups are inclusive of ALL humanity: past, present, and future members.
us which are saved--In the Greek the collocation is more modest, "to them that are being saved (that are in the way of salvation) as," that is, to which class we belong. -
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Sounds like you've been "across the pond" for a long while, now. [FONT=verdana,sans-serif] [/FONT][FONT=verdana,sans-serif] [/FONT][FONT=verdana,sans-serif] [/FONT]
Sorry! Just couldn't resist that one.
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Ed
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Wow, it's grown to three pages already. I will read the thread and reply to every post directed towards me when I get back from Auckland on sunday, or monday. I will be busy sunday too :)
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"Not actually a fully fledged Ruckmanite, but I believe as he does on the KJB, so I may as well put it out there for all to see."
and "Ruckman Knight"
Yeah - this should be interesting.
We need a popcorn eating smilie. -
Well, I changed it, because another brother requested it, and my response to him was probably less gracious than it should have been, but I tried to be friendly :)
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The topic of this thread is whether "saved' or 'being saved' is a proper translation of the passages in question.
If we don't get back there I will need to close the thread. -
Sorry. Please don't close it. I can answer the questions, but like I said, I am flying away in little less than 3 hours, and am just biding time at work until the flight. I hope it doesn't get closed before I get back
Thank you and God bless. -
Wrong. I am saved from sin, but I am being saved from the lusts of the flesh as i obey the Spirit.
I am yet to be as saved as I can get because the flesh is not eradicated.
But one day I will exit the realm where the flesh is a contradictory influence to my obedience to the Spirit, then I will be as saved as I can get!!!
There are those who collectively will become part of the Bride, yet they are still to be saved. They cannot be being saved for they are still LOST!
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As far as eternity is concerned, and God is concerned about eternity, I am SAVED!
As far as my mind can fathom time in its essence I am being saved, but I'll have to stick with God on this one, [personal attack snipped] -
John of Japan Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
As for the OP, from the standpoint of the Greek forms I think either translation is possible in each verse. -
I changed the title since this is not going to be a fight over the KJV itself, only the interpretation of these verses.
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[off topic comments deleted]
As for the "are saved - are being saved" thingie, it's only a matter of English usage, nothing to have a tizzy about. -
off topic post deleted
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"Are saved" means already.
"Being saved" means process, not completely saved. -
Php 1:6 (KJV1611 Edition):
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you, will performe it vntil the day of Iesus Christ:
Is 'being confident' a process or an already happened?
Answer: being confident here by Paul is DONE DID! -
Rest my case. -
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