In the book I read about the Shroud (sorry I can't remember its name) there is a tradition that the linen napkin that was around His face was also preserved.
Not sure what difference that would make in it's authenticity. However, if you were an apostle or one of the women who attended Jesus, would you save these clothes as something precious and proof of the empty tomb? It is certainly human nature to preseve the effects of those we love and not outside of the realm of possibility.
How can you explain the fact that the blood on the Shroud completely agrees with the wounds described to us in the Bible? Or that no one has ever been able to reproduce the image on the cloth?
We don't know if they wiped the worst of the blood off before he was placed in the tomb. My assumption would be that they did wash the body but blood from His many wounds still leaked out.
Have you heard of hyperbole? Exaggeration for effect? (Matt 5:29). Of course His dear face was the face of a Man.
Wounds on head - crown of thorns. Check.
Beaten on the face - swelling appears on the forehead and cheekbones. Check.
Wound in the side - Speared after His death. Check.
Hundreds of wounds on back and legs - scourging. Check.
I watched the History Channel show, too, called "The Real Face of Jesus" and it is amazing to me no one can explain the image scientifically. And that 3-D imaging gives us a look at the face and body of the man of the Shroud so perfectly. If it wasn't the "real thing", how could 3-D imaging applied to the cloth create a 3-D image? If it was 2-D, then the image would be distorted. As it was, the image was rendered perfectly showing a 3-D person was wrapped in the Shroud.
I believe that the image on the Shroud was not made by human hands, but by the very Image of our dear Lord and Savior.
I think a lot of bias and skepticism about the Shroud is simply because it is in the custody of the RCC. Put that aside and really think and pray about whether or not it is genuine by using the facts and your faith.
The Shroud of Turin
Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Alive in Christ, Apr 4, 2010.
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Although the Shroud is in the custody of the Catholic Church, the Vatican has never made any pronouncement that it is or isn't genuine. However, it has no doubt become an article of veneration for Christians of all stripes, just like the hem of Christ's garment in Matthew 14:6, or like Peter's shadow in Acts 5:15. Is the Shroud genuine? I don't think we will ever know.
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So you believe the bible exaggerated the sufferings of Christ?
When the bible says that His visage was marred more than any man and His form than the sons of men it didn't really mean it? -
NEVER take a computer enhanced product as proof of ANYTHING. A half way decent artist will a full understanding of how a digital product such as Adobe CSE works (there are other products for film rather than photos) can create any image he wants. An uninformed observer will NOT be able to tell from looking at the image that it was not an actual photograph. It takes yet another expert, this one in computer forensics, to decipher what was actually done to the image. If you are looking at a printed copy of that image, there is no way that I know of to tell if it is "real" or if it is the product of someone's imagination.
You simply cannot accept any image today at face value. -
Both Amy and Scarlett nailed it in their posts :thumbs: -
Here is an interesting link to the shroud with some additional recent information. (I too am a skeptic).
Complete article here:
http://www.worthynews.com/top/teleg...669-Hitler-wanted-to-steal-Turin-Shroud-html/ -
http://www.shroud.com/guscin.htm
Curious, why wouldn't you believe it is genuine? Surely a God who created the universe in seven days and could come to earth born of a virgin could create a simple image on a cloth at His Resurrection.
I don't recall the exact book I read about the Shroud, but you could try this one:
"The Blood and the Shroud" by Ian Wilson.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0684855291/?tag=baptis04-20
Or you could check out the evidence on this website: shroud.com -
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
There's a shroud over Turin?
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"This video is full of bad, outdated information, all of which has been disproved by the STURP team. There is no paint whatsoever on the Shroud. Barry Schwortz, the photographer for the STURP team, says so, along with the scientists who have worked on it. The blood on the Shroud is not only blood, but it is human blood, type AB. Bilirubin levels on the Shroud are very high, indicating this man died a violent death. Thorny pollens found near the head are native only to Israel." -
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Thinkingstuff Active Member
I mean who cares? Its a waste of time and effort to even think about. We really know how to waste time on things like this shroud. So what if its Jesus'? So what if it isn't? Who cares?
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When I was a senior in high school, I did a paper about the Shroud and, based on the information I found at the time (23 years ago), I leaned towards it being the real thing, but I wasn't 100% convinced. Now, I lean towards it not being real, but a very good forgery. -
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Scarlett O. ModeratorModerator
I can't speak for annsni, but I will try.
I think she means people who are obsessed with the shroud as a holy relic and they consider this "proof" of what they believe and their faith.
The Bible says that faith is the evidence of things NOT seen.
It's kind of like those who have hunted for Noah's Ark (which in my opinion is rotted away to nothingness) - what would have happened if they put all of that time and energy into growing in Christ and reaching the lost?
God doesn't want people to have faith in His Son based on a relic or icon.
This obsession that some have with the shroud (not anyone on the BB, but people in general) is like the obsession that some people in Rome who to this very day climb the steps of the Scala Santa on their hands and knees and kiss the painting at the top and believe that their sins are forgiven.
Religious relics and icons from all religions of all the world come to embody the believer's faith - and it's very, very sad. -
Oh come now, Scarlett. Your're a smart woman (even if you do like cats). You can't tell me that if you knew beyond any doubt the Shroud was the burial cloth of Jesus, that you wouldn't want to have it for yourself and keep it as close to you as possible. It would enhance, not detract from, your love of our Lord.
I'll tell you a personal story. There are no known photographs of my grandfather in existence, nor is there anything in existence he ever owned. He died before I was born. So imagine my exitement a few years back when I discovered a deed to a farm that he had written and signed when he was young. I treasure that document. It gives me a small window into his life and makes me feel closer to him.
I think that is the correct function of relics. They provide us with a connection to the owner of the object, and if the owner is Jesus, it draws us closer to Him. Isn't that a good thing? -
Scarlett O. ModeratorModerator
But I don't need any tangible treasures from Jesus to feel close to Him. And I shouldn't rest my faith in the tangible. He IS my treasure.
To seek after divine relics and to use them to develop one's faith just doesn't set well with me.
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