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Why James White Is Sick of The Calvinist Club

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Revmitchell, Dec 13, 2017.

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  1. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    If this is true, you have to remember that Adam, in his sinless and perfect humanity, sinned.
     
  2. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    Just to clarify, Adam initially was not in such bondage. So free will may have been an option for him prior to the fall. Is that a correct statement?
     
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I do NOT think God authors sin, but that after the fall, God is allowing all humans to receive the sin nature that Adam found to now be in Him!
     
  4. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    What was the result of Adam's Rebellion?
     
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    He had the potential to sin being human, Jesus could not , as being very God also!
     
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Adam freely chose to rebel against God, yes....
     
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  7. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    Do you practice infant baptism?
     
  8. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    So Jesus was less than human...less than Adam in terms of His humanity?
     
  9. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    So God allowed or permitted man to receive the "sin nature" that Adam discovered in himself? Where did it come from? Did Adam have it before he sinned?
     
  10. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Again, word games. Think of God as an earthly king for a moment. He tells his servants, plant anything you like in your fields. A servant then freely chooses to plant corn. Another freely chooses to plant beans. God remained in control, yet gave His servants a free choice.
     
  11. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    You’re looking at James anachronistically. He’s writing to a post-fall people and your applying it to the pre-fall world.

    That James says this, along with boatloads of biblical evidence shows you to be incorrect.

    Would you argue that the mankind God created on the garden desired “only evil continually?” For your idea to be correct you would have to do so.

    It is clear in nearly every page of scripture that something has happened to man between Genesis 3 and 4.

    The Archangel.


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  12. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    I would argue that Adam, being made in God's image, sought a type of equality with God as something to grasp. I would argue that Adam was tempted by his desires and transgressed God's command. Sin and death entered the world and men were enslaved, condemned and corrupt. And I would argue that as men sought their will God gave them over to unnatural desires.

    Jesus has a human nature to include natural desires of the flesh, yet He did not sin. No passage presents Jesus as being less than man in His humanity. No passage describes Adam as having anything but a human nature.
     
  13. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    Sorry. I must have done edits to that post and didn't realize my error. I meant to say that God certainly knew what would happen.
     
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  14. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    Of course He did.

    No.

    No.

    Limited "freedom".

    Given the choice, no sinful man would take it because no man is free in the way in which you believe he is.
     
  15. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    On this board quite a bit
     
  16. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that Eve is tempted, and it’s not by something within herself. Adam, on the other hand, eats the fruit Eve gives him, and in that is some type of rebellious sin. So you’d have to argue Adam is created in some type of imperfection where he desires equality with God, which the text clearly does not support.

    The Archangel


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  17. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    Scripture states that Eve saw that the fruit was "good for food", a "delight to the eyes", and desirable to make one wise. This certainly appeals to something within. Scripture does not present Adam or Eve as getting a new "sinful nature".
     
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Nope, am a Baptist, so practice believers!
     
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  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No. exactly the same in his humanity as Adam was before the fall!
     
  20. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    Again, you’re ignoring the text. What you’ve quoted here is after the temptation. She sins after an external temptation. She uses her intellect to adjudicate the fruit, ignoring the law God had given.

    The Archangel


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