1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Young Earth - Old Earth

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by robycop3, Dec 24, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    9,016
    Likes Received:
    93
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Is the earth only some 6K years old, or is it some 4.5 billion years old? What about the "gap theory"? May we have a "peaceful" discussion about it, free of ad-hominem & "heretic" accusations by either side?

    I'll open this: I'm an "old-earther", based upon the many empirical proofs God has placed at our disposal & allowed or even caused us to discover, such as the speeda light & the fact that many stars or galaxies are so far away that it takes their light millions of years to reach us. (While we can slow light down, we cannot speed it up more than its usual travel speed of over 186K miles per second. Electricity & most rays of energy other than light move at this same speed; none faster.)

    And Scripture says God worked on an ALREADY-EXISTING earth!
    Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was[a]formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.
    a - or"waste & empty"


    So, we see God re-modeled an already-existing earth!

    There is much more empirical evidence indicating a great age for the earth & the universe. I only gave two of them to open the discussion.
     
  2. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    23,150
    Likes Received:
    1,753
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Eh, God delights in showing "empirical evidence" to be ofttimes untrustworthy.

    e.g. The resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.
    His Virgin Birth... etc.

    Yes Young Earth here.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    34,566
    Likes Received:
    866
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I am a Younger earth, not exactly 6, 000, but by FAR less than millions, much less Billions of Years!
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    9,016
    Likes Received:
    93
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Another OE clue: I live near the Appalachian Mts, & upon either side of almost any road cut thru one of them, we see many layers of different kind of rock. We can alse see that rock once rose much-higher than it is now. In fact, the Appys were once as high as the Rockies. But they've been eroded 'WAY down!

    Now, had that erosion occurred rapidly, there'd be no soil upon those mountains, nor any soil left in the valleys & "hollers" between the hills. Also, the rocks would be broken in many places. But the soil layers, quite-thick on many of those hills, shows a gentle, gradual erosion that took millions of years.
     
    #4 robycop3, Dec 24, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2018
    • Informative Informative x 1
  5. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    9,016
    Likes Received:
    93
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Another OE clue: the famous DEVIL'S TOWER in Wyoming, featured in the movie Close Encounters of the Third Kind.(1977) It's the remains of the crater of a small volcano. The tower is composed of porphyritic phonolite, which is a heavier,harder igneous rock than ordinary volcanic pumice, and is often found in the necks of active volcanoes.As time passed, the volcano became extinct, & the softer rock around the neck of the dead volcano eroded away. This took MILLIONS of years, as a quick, violent removal of the surrounding rock woulda destroyed the tower. (The tower is 867 feet high from its base.)

    As I said in the OP, GOD provides empirical evidence for an OE.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    34,566
    Likes Received:
    866
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Or under the effects of a world wide Flood!
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  7. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    138
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Regardless of your stance, these miracles don't really address the issue. You are not suggesting a medical exam would have shown Mary had been known by a man, nor are you saying that Jesus did not die or was not bodily raised from the dead. Though miracle was involved, these happened in normal time. Mary carried to term. Jesus went through all stages as man, suffered on the cross, and experienced death.

    Oh, Merry Christmas (and Happy Easter)!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
    Messages:
    7,795
    Likes Received:
    402
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Interesting observation, Hank.
    Others have made similar observations but drawn different conclusions.
    John Walton, (who supports a 7-“day” creation) uses the observation of quirky physical evidences and recognizes that Scripture accomodates to the scientific beliefs of the people to whom it was addressed.
    The Bible was not written to us, it was written for us.

    The Bible Contains No New Revelation About the Workings and Understanding of the Material World
    “In God’s revelation to Israel, he did not give them a more advanced understanding of the moon in accordance with its material nature. Instead he communicated in terms of what they knew”
    John H. Walton, The Lost World of Scripture, page 49.
    Rob
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    13,071
    Likes Received:
    1,072
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I tend to affirm a young old earth view.

    (Creation in its infancy was not an infant Creation....Adam created as an adult, chickens before eggs, trees with rings, etc).
     
  10. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    23,150
    Likes Received:
    1,753
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Indeed the miracles of the bible defy the findings of empirical evidence.

    e.g. wine normally takes 2-3 years to produce following the natural laws of nature (grow grapes, harvest, squeeze, age, bottle, market).

    Jesus did it instantaneously.

    Loaves and fishes?

    Universe?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    14,824
    Likes Received:
    639
    Faith:
    Baptist
    AiG points out the scientific problems connected with OE geology of Devils Tower.

    "If we approach the evidence with the idea that the earth is millions of years old, we are left with inconsistencies. If Devils Tower had been exposed through slow erosion of the land, numerous things about the tower would be different. First, the formation would have mostly likely eroded completely away since we can observe it eroding even today. Secondly, the formation would have cracked and broken apart due to the constant freezing and thawing occurring each year over millions of years. Lastly, the top of Devils Tower would be dramatically smaller than its base, as erosion slowly exposed more and more of the tower. These visible contradictions speak against the evolutionary interpretation of the evidence and confirm the Biblical age of just a few thousand years."
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    14,824
    Likes Received:
    639
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Assuming for the moment that the speed of light is constant and that the universe is 14.5 billion years old, then there has not been enough time for light to go from one end of the universe to the other end.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. 37818

    37818 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    801
    Likes Received:
    41
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Zircon crystal uranium dating of a meteorite gives us the 4.5 billion years for the age of the Earth.
     
  14. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2017
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    138
    Faith:
    Baptist
    This seems a bit better, as the time element changes, but the problem remains. Would superficial apparent age bear up under scientific scrutiny? For example, would the normal flaws due to aging, processing, parasites, etc., be present? This might pose some problems regarding man in the pre-Fall Garden, but much less so outside.

    There is no good reason to assume the evidence of miracle was erased. It is just as reasonable to assume that whatever miracle happened would leave direct evidence. In this case, Adam, who superficially appeared say 20 years old, would test as new. But as a real biblical case, consider the leprous Naaman. When he was healed “his flesh came again like unto the flesh of a little child, and he was clean,” (2 Kings 5:14b).
     
  15. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    14,824
    Likes Received:
    639
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Is there a chain of custody to show that the rate has always been the same or is that assumed?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. 37818

    37818 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    801
    Likes Received:
    41
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you know why the half life is presumed to be a constant?
     
  17. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    14,824
    Likes Received:
    639
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, why is it presumed to be a constant for the last 4.5 billion years?
     
  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    23,150
    Likes Received:
    1,753
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Adam/Eve DNA might bring a surprise today?
     
  19. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 23, 2002
    Messages:
    14,824
    Likes Received:
    639
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It would be the same as yours except with mutatations. Eve is considered the most beautiful woman ever, and I think that Adam was the most intelligent man and probably the strongest, but I don't know if that is right.
     
  20. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    23,150
    Likes Received:
    1,753
    Faith:
    Baptist
    But did "Original Sin" have an effect on their DNA?
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...