Candy:
"The deception of Satan was that Eve could use her own human will when "knowing" good and evil."
GE:
The deception of Satan was that Eve could use her own human will! Spot on!
After "knowing" good and evil, it was too late -- poor dead sinner! To what use had been her knowledge, wisdom or will?
An honest look at "free-will" #1: Gen.3:4-6
Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by canadyjd, Feb 10, 2007.
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Gerhard Ebersoehn Active MemberSite Supporter
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It is instructive that empty claims of that form - are in fact empty. It is the EVIDENCE that supports them or fails to support that has substance.
Hopefully this is now obvious to you. -
Gen 3:22 regarding the condition of "KNOWING BOTH good and evil" is the SAME term used in Gen 4 for Adam knowing Eve. It is a term for "knowing by experience".
That is where your position totally falls apart because EVERYONE can see that BEFORE the fall of man BEFORE sin -- the ONLY thing mankind knew "by experience" was OBEDIENCe - was God who is "Good".
You have not been able to refute this glaringly obvious point in all this time sir.
In Christ,
Bob -
Gerhard Ebersoehn Active MemberSite Supporter
I can scarcely find fault with this. I think your "peace to you" quite apt after your explanation. What' Bob's problem then? -
You then use my words to claim that YOU gave me the words by #, which you most certainly did not, (and are even refusing to acknowledge they are different words), and that, sir, is intellectually dishonest, and worse.
peace to you:praying: -
There is no sense in discussing this further with you. No amount of facts will sway you, I am confident.
peace to you:praying: -
peace to you:praying: -
What is even better, in terms of slaying your repeated assertions that they already "knew" good by experience, is that he clearly says she acquired the experience of the "happiness of a holy...condition", AFTER her "eyes were opened". That means AFTER she ate of the tree, which is AFTER the fall.
How embarrassing for you to be shown your error by the very scholar you quoted to support your position.
But on the bright side, you now know of a scholar that agrees with what I have been saying.
peace to you:praying: -
Jamiesson does NOT argue that man did not "know good until he sinned" NOR does the Bible make such a wild irrational claim.
As we saw in Gen 3 AND in Gen 4 the word for "KNOW" means to "KNOW experientially". Adam EXPERIENCED obedience and then Adam EXPERIENCED rebellion.
Obviously.
In Christ,
Bob -
Jamieson on Gen 2 and the GOOD that Adam and Eve KNEW in the form of joyful "OBEDIENCE" and worship of the one True God BEFORE they rebelled against God.
As we can clearly see from the text above. Twisting it around for the readers here as Canady has done does not reflect the clear point of Jamieson's writing.
In Christ,
Bob -
Gerhard Ebersoehn Active MemberSite Supporter
It's not of my concern, I know, yet still I don't understand what you two are fighting about. 'Much ado about nothing'?
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If Adam was created without actually knowing what GOOD WAS -- AS is being claimed - then how can you blame him for doing evil? He is much like a monkey in a cave - not knowing good OR evil.
In Christ,
Bob -
BobRyan
Like I have said previously, let's end this. I have no more to say to you, other than....
peace to you:praying: -
Agreed - I believe we have both stated our positions repeatedly and have given the reasons as to why we take them.
It is left for the reader to consider the evidence and choose.
God's blessings.
in Christ,
Bob -
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