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Are certain political views sinful?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Calminian, Sep 5, 2019.

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  1. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Of course Paul was writing directly to Christians in Rome and the issues they were facing. That doesn't mean there isn't a broader application to all Christians.

    Paul is far more concerned about believers actions than the government's actions. I think his purpose was to give a general statement of God's sovereignty in establishing governments even though they were experiencing persecution.

    He had stated earlier in Romans that all things work together for good toward those that love Jesus and are called. Paul is always focused on furthering the gospel of Jesus Christ. Paul never proposed that we use governments to force Christian beliefs on people.

    His focus was the gospel. That was his focus and should be ours.

    I don't believe Paul was saying the Roman government was a great government. There were obvious problems, far greater than the issues we face in the U.S. I don't think he would approve of attempting to use government for furthering the gospel.

    Peace to you.
     
  2. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    You will continue to be disappointed if you trust in a secular government.

    Peace to you
     
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  3. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    The Bible does not seem to provide specific guidance on believer's duties toward representative governance. I think voting for those whose words and actions mirror what we believe is the will of God is following Christ's command to give unto Caesar what is due.

    I believe to kill an unborn baby is homicide, and can only be considered justifiable homicide if it is to protect the life of the mother.

    MLK said evil triumphs when good people do nothing. Jesus tells us to always do right, even in the little things.
     
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  4. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    I think this is a pretty good handling of the issue overall. Emancipation is probably the biggest triumph of the Church in America in the political arena. And the truth is, we're only a couple of judges away from a triumph for the unborn (though it's going to be a long battle).

    James said, "If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them."
     
  5. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    I think when you say this you're saying anyone who votes or advocates for a political solution is "trusting government." I think Christians are much smarter than this. You've made it black and white, only those sitting at home doing nothing are trusting in God. This is totally contrary to Scripture.

    James 4:17 If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them.​

    A Christians can both work hard for good, and also true wholly in God. It's a false charge you're making against the masses of Christians showing compassion and trying to help people. You've basically condemned the entire abolitionists movement of the 1800s as godless men not trusting in God.
     
  6. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    Here's what I've gathered from your posts:
    • Paul focused on the Gospel so we ignore just about everything else he commanded, including what he said in Romans 13.
    • Any work constitutes a lack of trust in God. If a Christian campaigned against slavery in the 1800s he did so because he trusted in government and himself over God. If a person campaigns and votes for pro-life candidates, he's trusting in man.
    • Conversely, if a person sits at home, never campaigns and never votes, he's the one that's full of faith.
    The Bible preaches a very different message. Christians can both work and wholly trust in God (we can walk and chew gum). They are not mutually exclusive.

    Not only that, the Bible says that one who does not work actually has a false faith (James 2).

    Paul commanded us to obey our government and honor it. He stated the purpose of governments was good and from Him. He stated their purpose is to minister to the innocent and punish evil.

    Seems to me, all your reasons for sitting out of politics are falling flat.
     
    #66 Calminian, Sep 9, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2019
  7. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    No, you have completely misunderstood, or just assumed the worst about, what I believe.

    I've never stated christians shouldn't vote. I've never stated you or anyone else who looks to be involved in politics has a "false faith", only that your focus is wrong.

    You are making false accusations against a brother in Christ. You have repeatedly made the false accusation that brothers and sisters in christ that are not involved in politics are "doing nothing".

    You are looking to a secular government to enforce your Christian beliefs. You are going to be disappointed.

    Every justice on the court has publicly stated Roe is settled law. It will never be overturned. You may get victory on issues like banning late term abortion, which has already been deemed constitutional, but I suspect several of the current state efforts (fetal heart rate and others) will be deemed unconstitutional. What will you do then?

    Look at all the disappointing rulings by a "conservative" court. Healthcare mandate-constitutional. Marriage equality-constitutional. Keeping money from planned parenthood-unconstitutional. Over and over, secular court rules against what you believe. And yet, you continue to believe this should be the focus of christians.

    Peace to you
     
  8. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    One more thing. When the court ruled the federal government could ban certain procedures used in late term abortions, it did not make all late term abortions unconstitutional. That is why we still have late term abortions today. Another disappointment.

    Peace to you.
     
  9. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    That’s a hard call to make.
     
  10. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    “[ the Jews] Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost [the end].” 1 Thessalonians 2:16 (KJV 1900)

    “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.” John 3:36 (KJV 1900)

    “For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.” Acts 3:22–23 (KJV 1900)
     
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Through prayer and action, NO MATTER THE DISAPPOINTMENTS I will continue to defend the lives of the unborn, forced suicides and other satanic abominations.
     
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  12. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    My grandpa was a coal miner in eastern PA. The privilege of belonging to a political party of his choice or voting in a booth without a coal mining manager in the booth with you telling you who to vote for was non existent. So my parents knew this and participated in politics was a privilege and honor. She was a Kennedy Democrat and he was a Goldwater Republican. Neither encouraged me on selecting a party or a candidate... that was my choice as a free American.
     
  13. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    God love ya
     
  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Thank you, He does indeed (surprisingly).

    Excuse me while I have some old fashioned oatmeal with raisins,1/2 and 1/2, washed down with kovfefe.
     
  15. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Just as long as you don’t breakfast with the Taliban
     
  16. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    HUH?
     
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  17. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    No, I'm speaking about what you have stated about me, repeatedly, that because I vote and advocate, I'm depending on government.

    Yes, you stated I was depending on government, assuming the worst.

    No, you're the one shaming and accusing me of depending on government. How quickly you forget your own words.

    Case in point.

    Many said the same thing about abolition. They sat home, didn't fight, did nothing, and then God granted the victory. They may have even gloated as time passed, and results were not apparent.

    I fight evil knowing that I can lose, but also knowing God will do his will and grant victories where he chooses. I don't decide beforehand what God can and can't defeat. I fight because I know he can win any battle. Anything is possible with God.
     
  18. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    What's interesting is, both Kennedy and Goldwater would be considered rightwing extremists today.
     
  19. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Working class always steer right... but not extreme.
     
  20. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    No, they'd be extreme. Kennedy was a nationalist and pro-life. He would be compared to Hitler everyday.
     
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