Faith plus right beliefs

I am not. That's your territory.

 

You say people can be saved without even knowing Christ... which is the same as saying that Salvation is not through Christ.

 

And for those that have never heard Christ, is there "another way?"

 

I believe that scripture affirms that through the Incarnation, Atonement, and Resurrection of Jesus, God in His mercy, love, and justice extends the benefits of Jesus's work to those who by no fault of their own never had a chance to hear the Gospel or know of Jesus, and this basis of judgment is the use they make of the light they have.

I don't know why it's so offensive to some to consider that God could be this compassionate. And why attack me in such a vile manner for believing it? I am not trying to force anyone else to believe it. And I am not attacking anyone else personally for not believing it.

 

What is offensive is saying one thing and believing another. You are not telling the truth. You just got through saying:

You can't believe in both of these positions that are posted. Either salvation is through Christ alone, or he is not. If he is through Christ alone, then that makes the first part of this post null and void. But the first part of this post is what you really believe, isn't it? You really don't believe that salvation is through Christ alone. You do believe that there is another way, and that is what is so offensive to so many on this board.

 

It is offensive because God has already told us in His Word that it is only those who have faith in Christ will be saved.

It is offensive because your heretical belief teaches that Jesus Christ is a liar.

 

I'm sorry that you can't see what I'm saying. I don't know how to explain it any better than what I have done. I believe that anyone whom God grants salvation to, he does it through Jesus and what Jesus did.

Still, if it is offensive to someone, why don't they attack the belief rather than attack me personally, calling me a cultist and comparing me with Satan? Sure, I have attacked back, and I admit that's wrong. But I never initiated personal attacks.

 

That is a vile lie.

 

No, it is not a lie.

The Word of God tells us that if we do not believe in Jesus we will die in our sins. Jesus said He is the door, He is the way the truth and the life.

You say people can be saved without knowing Jesus or the Gospel.

It is you who is not being truthful.

 

If others can be saved without the gospel, then:
1. You give up your responsibility to the Great Commission. "Leave it in God's hands; I am no longer responsible for the lost." But that is not what Jesus commanded. He commanded us to go into all the world.

2. You put yourself on the side of the hyper-Calvinist. God never elected them in the first place. And if he did, there is nothing that we can do, he will save them in his own time, in his own way, in his will. That is hyper-calvinism to the hilt.

3. But most of all it is a direct contradiction of Scripture:
Jesus said: "I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man comes unto the Father but by me."
You can't get by Christ, or His Word.

4. You also put yourself on the same side as the most liberal unbeliever.
"God is so loving he wouldn't send anyone to hell."
I hear it from the unsaved all the time. You are coming across that way also, and putting yourself close to that view.

 

I have shown where scripture supports my view. You disagree. Fine. Attack my beliefs all you want; I can handle that. But why do you have to get into personal attacks? I am not being untruthful; I am stating what I believe to be the truth.

Does it somehow boost your ego to call me a cultist and compare me to Satan?

 

Does it boost your ego to teach contrary to God's Word?

You have not shown where Scripture supports your view. You have only claimed that three passages support your view. Both DHK and myself have shown you why those Scriptures do not say what you want them to say.

 

From what you say here, the mentally disabled who do not understand and believe in Jesus will go to hell.
Now you explain how what you say in this thread is not for the mentally disabled.

 

How do you know that God does not give them the capacity to know Jesus? Do you have absolute proof that He does not reveal Himself to them?

The fact is, Scripture tells us that God gives to every man the measure of faith. I would think that would include even the mentally challenged.

 

Then you are saying that people who do not hear the gospel can still be saved!

 

This is a red herring. If you want to start a thread on mentally disabled and on infants then start another thread. Don't derail this one.

 

You have already derailed it. You are the one who posted first what you did. I only commented on it.

 

NO, I did not say that at all.

In the last church I was a member of, we had a mentally challenged girl that attended. She sat on the back pew of the Church. She heard the Gospel every service that she attended.

She is responsible what choice she makes regardless of her mental challenge.

 

Would you mind taking this to the other thread, the thread about those not hearing the gospel?

 

Jesus told the Jews in John 8:24, "Except ye believe that I am He, ye shall die in your sins."

One must believe in Jesus and who He is, or they will die in their sins.

Now I wonder why Jesus didn't give the Jews another option other than faith in Him? After all, the archbishop says one can be saved without even knowing Jesus or hearing the Gospel.

Oh, that's right, Jesus was speaking truth. He is the Way, not a way.