Featured "Few be there that find it"

By all means, let's study the Scriptures, this time Romans 9: 15-18.

15 For he says to Moses: “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."

16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God's mercy 17 For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."18 Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.

It only makes sense, that if God desires to have mercy in this instance, He can have mercy in any instance. He calls the shots!

 

No its not. And if anyone were to state that I or the Catholic church said we merited our own salvation they are guaranteed LIARS.

See we don't prioritize salvation, we understand that every single soul is precious to God.


Same chapter you mentioned:
John 6

36“He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”


To obey is what? Love God and Love Neighbor.

If I told two folks trust the driving instructor and you will past your driving test. One listens to the instructions and follows them, and the other Trusts and has faith and believes his instructor but doesn't actually do what is taught,

That second guy is going to run right into a tree. Oh well but I trusted and had faith in him says the 2nd guy why did I hit this tree?


I can find Love God and Love neighbor in every religion you can shake a stick at. Jesus had no problem finding it in the good Samaritan.


Romans 2

12For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; 13for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.



When we Christians are closer to looking like Nazis, we are doing it wrong. It certainly is with this Pharisee attitude of others.

John 10
37“If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”

John 14
11“Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me; otherwise believe because of the works themselves.

^If I were a Calvinist these statements would be totally nuts, Because these statements indicate that a person has the scope of understanding rather getting light switch flicked on by God.

JOHN 14 verse especially smashes your challenge.

He doesn't say Believe in me or your toast. You wish he did, don't you?


Otherwise is option 2. Believe because the works themselves.

The works themselves is LOVE GOD and LOVE NEIGHBOR. This is the highest priority it is BUILT into the first commandment.

1 john 4

8Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

The further you step away from love the more evil it is.

Anyone who can tell the difference between Love and God still has plenty still to learn about both.

 

Steaver, this is what I said: "We are not talking about Jesus here, we are not talking about what was written in the Scriptures. We are talking about God, the all powerful, the all knowing........". I mean in the context of the question that I am asking you, I am not invoking what IS written in the Scriptures that you cited. I asked a specific question and you will not answer it. I mean really, in your heart and in your mind you have got to know that God is all powerful, that He can do anything He wants, but for some reason you do not want to answer in the affirmative that God can indeed bestow mercy on whom He decides to.

What is the matter, is your fundamentalist interpretation of the Scriptures blown apart if God bestows His mercy on a Hindu or an atheist and allows them eternal rest in heaven? Has He somehow broken His promises to you if He were to do such a thing? Come on brother, confess your fears here, you are among friends.

 

Calvinist? Good grief, what does Calvinist doctrine have to do with the basic Christian belief that God is all powerful and all knowing? He is the first person of the Triune Godhead, He comes first, He made everything and as such is in control of everything and can do anything He wants. This fact cannot be denied and if you do deny it, then you have some serious theological problems.

 

'For we ourselves were also once disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another.
But when the kindness and the love of God our saviour toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and the renewing of the Holy Spirit' (Titus 3:3-5).

 

How is Him giving mercy to whom He want's lying? The fact is, it isn't. (As I clearly pointed out in Romans - which you so conveniently reject)

How about the Jews, they don't believe in Jesus, are they damned too?

If a Christian doesn't see the "born again" concept exactly as you do, they won't see heaven either?

 

Satan has belief and no love of God. Paul had no belief to warrant the merciful act of Christ's intervention. Jesus could have picked anyone to do Paul's work.

With inside of looking to kill Christians Paul was given an act of mercy by Jesus Christ.

 

Both and Neither. Earlier you mentioned the branches grafted in or not. God can allow you to become evil for the purpose and sake of another becoming good.

"For just as you once were disobedient to God, but now have been shown mercy because of their disobedience"

For example if it were not for Jewish disobedience there is no gentile obedience.

Romans 11

28From the standpoint of the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but from the standpoint of God’s choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers; 29for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For just as you once were disobedient to God, but now have been shown mercy because of their disobedience, 31so these also now have been disobedient, that because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy. 32For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.

You would say those Jews, hey they are enemies not believing Jesus is God. But from the standpoint of God they are beloved!

"because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy"

We Catholics are given this MERCY and we dump it right back at the Jews.
We are going to let it run past the brim to promote and have good Jews good Samaritans, good Muslims good Buddhist, even good Calvinists and good Baptist.


I view your priority of "Belief" flawed IF it is devoid of Love.

You are not a Calvinist, but anyone who believes in Faith Alone will eventually lead to Calvinism if they actually follow their own point of logic.


If Jesus Christ shows up in a brilliant light and blasts a Muslim vision blind, I'm going to put my money on that Muslim becoming Christian.

There is no such thing as a atheist standing before God.

People have great reasons for not believing in God and not believing in Jesus. And there are even Christians who "bet" there is a God, want badly to believe, and others who for peer pressure, fitting in and telling people what they want to hear "believe" in Jesus.



There Is plenty of people of here would not accept Jesus' character or God's as I present it.

If Muslim accepts a Jehovah's witness view of Jesus does he pass your criteria of belief?
I bet he does not.


Your cry for particular belief is like a Gnosticism, where you have to understand and have particular knowledge to be saved.

What I am telling you is God's #1 priority is Love. Another way of saying that is God's #1 priority is God. Another way of saying that is God's #1 priority is helping you.

You know you probably have no doubt that a person would not refuse to receive millions of dollars if you could give it to them, so the lesson is why would it even cross your mind or tarnish your own faith that anyone would refuse Jesus Christ ? It is very much within God's power to hold it back, their conversion, FOR YOUR SAKE.

 

Nothing in that sentence indicates they won't be saved.

You are reading into the text.

In fact that verse: "Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge". (Ro 10)

Thats what I think of you. You got the heart for it, Its my hope that you will be saved, but you have the wrong understanding.

But nothing about what I said or Paul says "Your not going to be saved" because you have bad understanding.



Gnostic knowledge is not a saving factor.

You can have complete knowledge, complete understanding. know all the mysteries concerning God, have all the belief obviously if you know everything, have all faith, and it is NOTHING BUT TRASH.

1 Corinthians 13

2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.



Now I'm giving you a FLAT OUT direct verse against prophecy, mystery, knowledge, faith being NOTHING. And LOVE being the prime important factor.

I don't have to change meanings, insert definitions, I can point right at that verse and say THATS IT.

Paul totally blows your idea of knowledge being a factor out of the water.

Every attempt to undermine, work around and dodge LOVE is an act of evil by its essence. When something is devoid of love it is sin.




"Which proves you have no idea. It appears you have created your own religion. I don;t even think it resembles Catholicism. Is all these twist and turns "Both and Neither" spelled out in the RCC doctrines somewhere ? Or did you come up with this stuff on your own?"

Because truth often can be a paradox. There is predestination and free will. I don't say there is only predestination and say there is no free will, nor do I take the other extreme that there is no predestination and only free will.

You can make blue cup or light-bulb it shines blue and a red one shines red. Or like a music record its going to play what it will play, but the essence of who you are, your free will decides what its going to play.

A "steaver" does exaclty what a "steaver" does. God created you, and you do freely make your choices all of which God knows already. You did not create yourself, God made you.


Do you remember making a choice to exist or did God "FORCE" you to exist? God is a prime ingredient in your life, you are a co-author with God setting the meaning of what it means to be a "Steaver".

 

It seems Ms. Brazille has apologized publically for her "go to hell" comment. Since she is a Christian, I would think that she will also at some point be seeking forgiveness from the Lord for her less than honorable comment.