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What is your thought on washing feet in the church.
- Thread starter charles_creech78
- Start date
Brother Bob
New Member
You mean you cannot feel the Spirit when you give the message? Is it just like reading a book to the people, and go home?
Brother Bob said:
I know when the Holy Spirit moves. Sometimes that brings great joy and sometimes great sadness depending on the response of the people.
Fellings are not needed to do ministry. God is needed. Faith is not based on feelings. Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. The people in 1 Peter and Jude based their joy in the midst of great trials and adversity on the hope that is to come. Joy is based on the security found in Jesus Christ.
Too many pastors and churches base their ministry on feelings and what the world teaches and attracts easy believeism Christians. They fail to base it on what is right according to scripture. Faith in Jesus Christ comes before feelings. There are times when I do not like helping someone but I know that whether I feel like it or not it is the right thing to do. Their need is not based on my feelings.
When I was an athlete winning the race was not based on feelings but enduring until the end until I crossed the finish line.
TCGreek said:
Could you cite a reference or two?
How could it possibly be serving one another if there is no need because people already have clean feet?
Now if a man comes into the assembly with feet that are dusty, dirty, and full of manure and needs shoes then by all means clean his feet and buy him some of the best shoes you can find so that it sends the message you love him. Why should we give those in need our second best?
gb93433 said:
Here's a quote from Augustine:
"But apart from this moral understanding of the passage [our text in John 13], we remember that the way in which we commended to your attention the grandeur of this act of the Lord's was that, in washing the feet of disciples who were already washed and clean, the Lord instituted a sign, to the end that, on account of the human feelings that occupy us on earth, however far we may have advanced in our apprehension of righteousness, we might know that we are not exempt from sin; which He thereafter washes away by interceding for us, when we pray the Father, who is in heaven, to forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors. . ." (Nicene & Post-Nicene Fathers by Phillip Schaff)
gb93433,
Regarding the topic of footwashing, here are several recent statments from you...
Why are you "preaching to the choir"? Dont you think that everyone on this thread goes along with all of that completly? Because we all do. All of us are doing practical ministry. All of us are caring for our brothers and sisters. All of us are sharing the gospel with people as God opens doors. All of us are "helping widows" and "visiting orphans" and "giving a cup of water" to those in need. We are all doing those things. Those things are NOT going undone.
But there is a...time...and...place...for...everything. There is a time for ministry and also a time worship. There is a time for practical needs being met and also a time to rest and let God bless us. That is all that is going on here. These folks who practice this footwashing are certainly involved in practical ministry. But this memorial they do is part of their worship time. Of course the people dont need their feet washed. They did that when they took their shower or bath. But these people are blessed and edified as a result of this activity. ITS O.K. TO BE BLESSED AND EDIFIED!
There is a time and place for ALL facets of the christian life
Here is a passage of scripture that I think will be good for this situation. Please give this passage of scripture your prayfull consideration....
"38 Now it happened as they went that He entered a certain village; and a certain woman named Martha welcomed Him into her house.
39 And she had a sister called Mary, who also sat at Jesus feet and heard His word.
40 But Martha was distracted with much serving, and she approached Him and said, "Lord, do You not care that my sister has left me to serve alone? Therefore tell her to help me."
41 And Jesus answered and said to her, "Martha, Martha, you are worried and troubled about many things. 42 But one thing is needed, and Mary has chosen that good part, which will not be taken away from her."
Notice. Martha was doing all the practical things. Serving. "Doing." Ministering. She was working hard and getting practical things done.
She was bugged because Mary wasnt "doing" ANYTHING. She was just resting and allowing her Lord to bless her.
What was Jesus response?
Grace and peace to you,
Mike
Regarding the topic of footwashing, here are several recent statments from you...
Why are you "preaching to the choir"? Dont you think that everyone on this thread goes along with all of that completly? Because we all do. All of us are doing practical ministry. All of us are caring for our brothers and sisters. All of us are sharing the gospel with people as God opens doors. All of us are "helping widows" and "visiting orphans" and "giving a cup of water" to those in need. We are all doing those things. Those things are NOT going undone.
But there is a...time...and...place...for...everything. There is a time for ministry and also a time worship. There is a time for practical needs being met and also a time to rest and let God bless us. That is all that is going on here. These folks who practice this footwashing are certainly involved in practical ministry. But this memorial they do is part of their worship time. Of course the people dont need their feet washed. They did that when they took their shower or bath. But these people are blessed and edified as a result of this activity. ITS O.K. TO BE BLESSED AND EDIFIED!
There is a time and place for ALL facets of the christian life
Here is a passage of scripture that I think will be good for this situation. Please give this passage of scripture your prayfull consideration....
"38 Now it happened as they went that He entered a certain village; and a certain woman named Martha welcomed Him into her house.
39 And she had a sister called Mary, who also sat at Jesus feet and heard His word.
40 But Martha was distracted with much serving, and she approached Him and said, "Lord, do You not care that my sister has left me to serve alone? Therefore tell her to help me."
41 And Jesus answered and said to her, "Martha, Martha, you are worried and troubled about many things. 42 But one thing is needed, and Mary has chosen that good part, which will not be taken away from her."
Notice. Martha was doing all the practical things. Serving. "Doing." Ministering. She was working hard and getting practical things done.
She was bugged because Mary wasnt "doing" ANYTHING. She was just resting and allowing her Lord to bless her.
What was Jesus response?
Grace and peace to you,
Mike
I see that passage as Martha was not focused on Jesus but upon herself. She was busy about making herself feel good and comfortable rather than focused on Jesus. That is the problem with so many churches today. Just look at the prayer meetings today. Take a look at the leaders in churches today discipling people. Personally I have pastored and been in very few churches where the leaders are even making disciples. 2/3 of the churches in America are dead or dying. What does that say about leaders training people to make disciples?D28guy said:
Brother Bob
New Member
Luke 7:
37: And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that Jesus sat at meat in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster box of ointment,
38: And stood at his feet behind him weeping, and began to wash his feet with tears, and did wipe them with the hairs of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment.
Jhn 13:34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
gb93433: Amazing that you would condemn feetwashing with such vigor! I am not condemning you for not doing it, that is up to you and the Lord.
37: And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that Jesus sat at meat in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster box of ointment,
38: And stood at his feet behind him weeping, and began to wash his feet with tears, and did wipe them with the hairs of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment.
Jhn 13:34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
gb93433: Amazing that you would condemn feetwashing with such vigor! I am not condemning you for not doing it, that is up to you and the Lord.
Last edited by a moderator:
Magnetic Poles
New Member
I have never gotten why some church's do that whole foot wash thing. No thanks! NASTY!!
Magnetic Poles said:
I wonder why I am not surprised you would have this type of attitude regarding foot washing.
Pride is IMHO, the #1 reason footwashing is not acceptable in today's churches, considering it is biblical, practiced by Christ, and given as an example of humility.
Brother Bob
New Member
You have just accused the Lord of being NASTY!!
Brother Bob said:
I think condemning it is a little strong. I just think it is a waste of God's time and the people involved. I see no eternal value in it. I do not see that it is serving anyone or any purpose to glorify God.
When I consider the lack of Bible knowledge among Christians and the lack of zeal, I have to wonder what is going on when we have such ignorance and emphasis placed on other things which are non-essentials and of no eternal value.
We are in desperate need of people in America who know their Bibles and share their faith.
I only have to ask myself one question, "What will last for eternity?"
The position of a foot washer was that of a servant. I see absolutely no value in foot washing today. It is not a part of our culture. Imagine if I knew a non-believer who had a need and decided to wash his feet. Why wash feet when it is not a need? I can remember the days that we dipped out our own septic tanks. The need of the moment was to dip out the septic tank. If you had come along I would have been glad to let you help. When I was in college and needed some money to pay my tuition the need at the moment was tuition money. I attended a church for many years, that would take up a collection for those in need. A person never walked out of that church with unmet needs if anyone knew about it. The church should be about serving people, meeting their needs, and protecting the lowliest in society.
If a person comes along who needs his feet washed I would have no problem doing that. I would also do my best to buy him a good quality pair of shoes. However to wash feet that are already clean and there is not any need, it is nothing more than a ritual.
When I sit in a worship service I do not want to be there for 75 min. and walk out feeling that the preacher wasted my time because he talked about things of no eternal value. When I bring non-believers to church I do not want them to feel as though their time is wasted by uselesss talk.
Think about what John Wesley said, "Give me one hundred preachers who fear nothing but sin and desire nothing but God, and I care not a straw whether they be clergymen or laymen, such alone will shake the gates of hell and set up the kingdom of God upon the earth."
By the time I had entered college I had never heard one Christian ever share their faith with me. What good are people like that? How do people like that serve God? There was a student who brought his Bible to class but never once did I ever hear him name the name of Christ.
Magnetic Poles
New Member
No, it was a different time with different health standards. People didn't know about germs at all. Jesus was making a point about serving our fellow human beings. Today, yes, it is NASTY!Brother Bob said:
Brother Bob
New Member
The Lord didn't know about germs?
Brother Bob
New Member
Magnetic Poles
New Member
I didn't say that.Brother Bob said:
First of all this was both a necessity and a cultural thing because most folks walked wherever they went.
The roads were for the most past dirt which equates to dirty feet because people wore sandals without socks or in some cases went barefoot.
It was considered a social act of kindness because it was refreshing plain and simple to have your dirty and tired old dogs bathed and cleaned in a cool basin of water.
Secondly Jesus often drew from life itself to teach spiritual lessons often with literal words which in and of themselves were difficult.
Matthew 5
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
At very least we should draw what spiritual application we can from the foot washing ceremony that Jesus used as an object lesson of humility. Using Himself (God come in the flesh) as the model example.
Philippians 2
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
At best (IMO) we ought not to offend our brethren with disparaging words who see and practice this service as an act of affection for those they love in the Lord. Conversely, we ought not to look down upon those who don’t do it though we ourselves do the practice.
Any then using a little wisdom: Even if Christ did not mean it as an ordinance and even though it is not part of today’s culture here in America (other than in churches) what could it hurt?
What does hurt is belittling each other for the doing or not doing.
Love one another?
I know we love one another but we need to express it a little better in our debates (IMO).
HankD
The roads were for the most past dirt which equates to dirty feet because people wore sandals without socks or in some cases went barefoot.
It was considered a social act of kindness because it was refreshing plain and simple to have your dirty and tired old dogs bathed and cleaned in a cool basin of water.
Secondly Jesus often drew from life itself to teach spiritual lessons often with literal words which in and of themselves were difficult.
Matthew 5
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
At very least we should draw what spiritual application we can from the foot washing ceremony that Jesus used as an object lesson of humility. Using Himself (God come in the flesh) as the model example.
Philippians 2
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
At best (IMO) we ought not to offend our brethren with disparaging words who see and practice this service as an act of affection for those they love in the Lord. Conversely, we ought not to look down upon those who don’t do it though we ourselves do the practice.
Any then using a little wisdom: Even if Christ did not mean it as an ordinance and even though it is not part of today’s culture here in America (other than in churches) what could it hurt?
What does hurt is belittling each other for the doing or not doing.
Love one another?
I know we love one another but we need to express it a little better in our debates (IMO).
HankD
Archeryaddict
New Member
my thoughts
we are to serve one another
not to build a doctrine on washing feet.
that is all
we are to serve one another
not to build a doctrine on washing feet.
that is all
gb93433 said:
1. I provided a quote from Augustine. But you have made no effort to deal with it.
2. Feet washing as a rite is not a waste of time. Per your argument anything that we do that "I do not see that it is serving anyone or any purpose to glorify God" should be dismissed.
3. But I so thankful that it is what you see and not what the Lord sees.
4. You have provided no substantial scriptural argument to dismiss feet washing as a waste of time. Instead, you are going on and on about "wasting time."
5. In fact, "wasting time" has become your staple in this whole argument.