Pensacola Christian College

[SteveB]

Originally posted by Baptist Believer:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by PastorGreg:
BB, in Matthew 23, Jesus told His disciples to do what the Pharisees taught, just not what they did.

If you check that passage, you’ll notice that He’s talking about their teaching of what Moses specified.

I was not talking about the Law, but of the religiosity – that is, the false standards of religious propriety – that the Pharisees taught and practiced. They were scandalized by the way that Jesus associated with the “sinners”, spoke to women and did not follow the “proper” social customs of their legalism.

High standards, in and of themselves, do not create Pharisees and hypocrites.

You are correct, but adding to the commandments of God – such as the rules for distance between person of opposite genders – often leads to legalism and hypocrisy. </font>[/QUOTE]PCC does not go around measuring distances between genders, but we do use common sense in helping students learn how to conduct themselves. Let's face it; many times even Christian kids don't know how to conduct themselves. If we see that a guy and gal are getting to chummy with each other to a point where it looks like they are not conducting themselves in a Christian manner, they get dimerits. Even staff and faculty members are encouraged not to show public displays a affection on campus because we don't want the students to be envious, and we are happy to comply for the sake of the students. There's nothing legalistic that we do at PCC; everything is done to help a student grow in the Lord.

 

[swaimj]

Even staff and faculty members are encouraged not to show public displays a affection on campus because we don't want the students to be envious...

Certainly there is physical activity within a marriage that is private and not for public display. To derive from that fact that ALL public displays of physical affection are out of place is wrong. Showing public physical affection to one you truly love is a GOOD example for young people. It SHOULD provoke them to want to follow that example. The faculty and staff should not practice ABSTINENCE in this area, but they should practice MODERATION. MODERATION is the biblical principle that needs to be modeled. What PCC is doing is replacing a biblical principle (moderation in all things) with a man-made (and wrong-headed) rule. What PCC is doing is modeling legalism. Shame on them!!!

 

[A Fiery Fundamentalist]

Ashley (aka Cheerfreakus):

Any good place is likely to be attacked by those who are either disgruntled or void of understanding. I am leaving for PCC in two days for my first year, and, I must say, I am really looking forward to it. I have visited there, too, liked what I saw, have a couple of friends who are going there, and had a sister who went there before a serious medical problem forced her home. That www.pensacolachristiancollege.com site, to me, seems to be made up of nothing but a bunch of petty complaints by whining crybabies who cannot stand even a little authority. much less the good amount exercised at PCC. Frankly, I am looking forward to structure in my life; I am type who thrives in that kind of environment, and the Christian high school I graduated from was much too loose for my taste. Well, I hope you go to the college God wants you to go to. God bless you.

 

[SteveB]

Originally posted by swaimj:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Even staff and faculty members are encouraged not to show public displays a affection on campus because we don't want the students to be envious...

Certainly there is physical activity within a marriage that is private and not for public display. To derive from that fact that ALL public displays of physical affection are out of place is wrong. Showing public physical affection to one you truly love is a GOOD example for young people. It SHOULD provoke them to want to follow that example. The faculty and staff should not practice ABSTINENCE in this area, but they should practice MODERATION. MODERATION is the biblical principle that needs to be modeled. What PCC is doing is replacing a biblical principle (moderation in all things) with a man-made (and wrong-headed) rule. What PCC is doing is modeling legalism. Shame on them!!! </font>[/QUOTE]As I mentioned, there are a lot of students that come from backgrounds where they don't know the proper conduct and if PCC allowed public displays of affection, then it gives them an "open door" of thinking they can go further. Just because it is a Christian college doesn't mean that everyone is living for the Lord. There have been numerous times on campus that if you give someone a foot they'll take a mile in their actions.

 

[SteveB]

Originally posted by A Fiery Fundamentalist:
Ashley (aka Cheerfreakus):

Any good place is likely to be attacked by those who are either disgruntled or void of understanding. I am leaving for PCC in two days for my first year, and, I must say, I am really looking forward to it. I have visited there, too, liked what I saw, have a couple of friends who are going there, and had a sister who went there before a serious medical problem forced her home. That www.pensacolachristiancollege.com site, to me, seems to be made up of nothing but a bunch of petty complaints by whining crybabies who cannot stand even a little authority. much less the good amount exercised at PCC. Frankly, I am looking forward to structure in my life; I am type who thrives in that kind of environment, and the Christian high school I graduated from was much too loose for my taste. Well, I hope you go to the college God wants you to go to. God bless you.

Looking forward to having you Ashley! Look me up when you get here. I work in the Library in Cataloging. If you want, you can be our campus daughter under the Campus Kids program if you are coming as a freshman.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by SteveB:
As I mentioned, there are a lot of students that come from backgrounds where they don't know the proper conduct…

Oh! I didn’t realize that PCC was designed for students who have had discipline problems or who are not ready to be out on their own.

So it’s kind of like a military academy then…

There have been numerous times on campus that if you give someone a foot they'll take a mile in their actions.

Ah, yes. Spiritually immature folks.

Is there a process where the rules are relaxed as the student become upperclassmen?

 

[SteveB]

Originally posted by Baptist Believer:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by SteveB:
As I mentioned, there are a lot of students that come from backgrounds where they don't know the proper conduct…

Oh! I didn’t realize that PCC was designed for students who have had discipline problems or who are not ready to be out on their own.

So it’s kind of like a military academy then…

There have been numerous times on campus that if you give someone a foot they'll take a mile in their actions.

Ah, yes. Spiritually immature folks.

Is there a process where the rules are relaxed as the student become upperclassmen? </font>[/QUOTE]We have all kinds of students. As I mentioned before, the rules are there because of a biblical principle, something happened in the past that they've had to add the rule, or something they've just wanted to incorporate to have college spirit. Or for the safety of the students. Not all rules have to be to build a student spiritually.

The important thing is that the school wants to glorify God and help students to get a good education while at the same time grow spiritually. People get hung up on the rules, KJV only, the fact that we don't go along with the contemporary music crowd, but so what? That is just they've decided to have and if a person doesn't agree with it then that is all right. We teach that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God, Salvation through Jesus alone, and the other Biblical doctrines of Christianity. The other things are just what they've chosen to incorporate.

There are many things that the school has changed that would have been to the liking of the anti-rules crowd (for a lack of a better term) that students have suggested, so it's not like the school is not open to changing things.

I personally did not think I was going to like the school when I first came here, but I came here because of the tuition price. But it was the best for me to be here because it helped me to grow.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

In previous posts, the comment was made that likened PCC to a military academy. Personally, I would have no problem with that desigantion. Truth be known, calling a school like PCC a military academy is a pretty good discription of its function and mission. For years, I have referred to my alma mater Maranatha BBC as "West Point-on-the-Rock River" and BJU as "The Citadel on Wade Hampton Blvd". Why? Because both schools (and particularly MBBC) focus on training leaders for the church (again the MBBC clause: for local Baptist Churchs), just as West Point, Annapolis, the Air Force Academy or the Coast Guard Academy seek to train our military's leadership.

 

[Siegfried]

SteveB,

On your profile I found this tidbit:

My local Baptist church:
Pensacola Christian College

Would you care to explain how Pensacola Christian College is a Baptist church? Who is the congregation? Does the College immerse? Have an organized membership role in which the members vote on new members? Does the congregation exercise church discipline? Elect deacons? Call the pastor?

Unless the polity of the College "church" has changed from when PCC grads and staff have described it to me in the past, I question whether you are the member of a Baptist church, and I would have my doubts as to whether you are posting in this forum legitimately. Perhaps I am incorrect.

 

[SteveB]

Originally posted by Siegfried:
SteveB,

On your profile I found this tidbit:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />My local Baptist church:
Pensacola Christian College

Would you care to explain how Pensacola Christian College is a Baptist church? Who is the congregation? Does the College immerse? Have an organized membership role in which the members vote on new members? Does the congregation exercise church discipline? Elect deacons? Call the pastor?

Unless the polity of the College "church" has changed from when PCC grads and staff have described it to me in the past, I question whether you are the member of a Baptist church, and I would have my doubts as to whether you are posting in this forum legitimately. Perhaps I am incorrect. </font>[/QUOTE]I put in there PCC because it didn't say "Your local church" so I had no choice. The church is on the campus and even though the church is independent, the closest denomination it could mirror would be Baptist. Most of the visiting pastors that come here to preach in chapel and special functions are Baptists.

 

[Bible-boy]

As far as I know the Chapel on the campus of a Christian College does not constitute a "Baptist Church." Therefore, as a moderator on this forum I am requesting the poster "SteveB" to provide the actual name of his local church where he holds membership in his profile. Otherwise, we will have to consider him a non-Baptist who is posting in a "Baptist Only" section of the boards.

Yours in Christ,

BibleboyII

 

[SteveB]

Originally posted by BibleboyII:
As far as I know the Chapel on the campus of a Christian College does not constitute a "Baptist Church." Therefore, as a moderator on this forum I am requesting the poster "SteveB" to provide the actual name of his local church where he holds membership in his profile. Otherwise, we will have to consider him a non-Baptist who is posting in a "Baptist Only" section of the boards.

Yours in Christ,

BibleboyII

I apologize. I didn't know that non-Baptists could not post on here. The name of the church is just The Campus Church on Pensacola Christian College. I won't post any more messages.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Steve - no one is asking you not to post any more messages. Just select one of the many OPEN forums that are for all christians and post away!

The Campus Church at PBC is a whole-owned profit making venture run 100% by the Horton family. It in no way fits the definition of a BAPTIST church even though many Baptists speak there.

And to many of us, we question the use of the word "church" there at all. Other christian colleges have chapel and some even have Sunday services. But they do not presume to call that hybrid a "church"

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by Dr. Bob Griffin:
The Campus Church at PBC is a whole-owned profit making venture run 100% by the Horton family. It in no way fits the definition of a BAPTIST church even though many Baptists speak there.

I don't want to derail the thread, but would you tell me more about this "church"?

How does one make a profit running a "church" if you're not a television evangelist? Do they sell stuff or is it a lecture hall where admission is charged?

 

[RaptureReady]

Originally posted by SteveB:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by BibleboyII:
As far as I know the Chapel on the campus of a Christian College does not constitute a "Baptist Church." Therefore, as a moderator on this forum I am requesting the poster "SteveB" to provide the actual name of his local church where he holds membership in his profile. Otherwise, we will have to consider him a non-Baptist who is posting in a "Baptist Only" section of the boards.

Yours in Christ,

BibleboyII

I apologize. I didn't know that non-Baptists could not post on here. The name of the church is just The Campus Church on Pensacola Christian College. I won't post any more messages. </font>[/QUOTE]No need to apologize, if I'm correct and I believe I am, the PCC is a independent, fundamental, Bible Believing Baptist Church.

 

[Bible-boy]

From the Official PCC Website Articles of Faith located here :

Pensacola Christian College serves a constituency of churches across America which is primarily independent Baptist. Faculty, staff, and students attend Campus Church, which operates in the spirit of an independent Baptist church in both faith and practice.

Several questions come to mind:

1. What does "operates in the spirit of an independent Baptist Church" mean?

2. Does that mean that it is "like" an Independent Baptist Church, but in reality it is not an Independent Baptist Church?

3. Is the PCC "Campus Church" a covenanted body of believers, with a church constitution and by-laws, which fulfills the two ordinances of the church (baptism and the Lord's Supper) and practices church discipline?

4. Is it merely a campus chapel?

5. If it is an Independent Baptist Church why don't they simply say that it is an Independent Baptist Church?

 

[aefting]

I'm not a fan of the way PCC runs things and I think their Campus Church concept is off-base, but it's not any more off-base than some of the other "baptist" churches that are represented here. I think we ought to give SteveB a break and let him post in the Baptist sections.

Andy

 

[Siegfried]

I am told that Greg Mutsch and Dell Johnson have both left during the past year or so. Anybody know the story behind their departure? If I understood correctly Mutsch was the Executive V.P. and Johnson was Dean of the Seminary (and front man for the infamous KJVO videos).

 

[Bible-boy]

Originally posted by aefting:
I'm not a fan of the way PCC runs things and I think their Campus Church concept is off-base, but it's not any more off-base than some of the other "baptist" churches that are represented here. I think we ought to give SteveB a break and let him post in the Baptist sections.

Andy

Hey Andy,

You would have to address your suggestion to the webmaster. He makes the rules. I am only one of the moderators on the BB who has been tasked with making sure folks abide by those rules. Additionally, as Dr. Bob has stated we are not saying that SteveB (or any other non-Baptist) is unwelcome to post in the sections of the BB that are open to all Christians. However, we do have the Baptist Only Forums and one must be a professing Baptist (member of a Baptist church) to post in those specific areas.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

As matters have developed over time, all that is required is for a person to identify themselves as a Baptist in the "My Religion" section. With that, the name of a specific local church is not required. This is to allow for our members a measure of anonymity. Some would feel a bit exposed if they listed their actual church of record. (I know I would. My Pastor {who is resonably well known in my arm of the Baptist galaxy, if not yours} has enough problems without being held held accountable for my foibles.) That being said, listing "Independent" is not sufficent.