Did God Create Evil and Sin for His Glory?

Well, I agree with most but never have been convinced of Lucifer .

Lets take this part;
Sometime in there 1/3 of the sinless angels sinned - lead by Lucifer.

Sinned against what? What did they do that was sin. It had to be something God didn't want them to do and if they did it then it was sin, will you agree with that?

Only because God is Good and was in the beginning before all the others.

God decided what good is and the absence of good then evil becomes present.

Let me put it this way Bob, Evil is the absence of Good. Evil does not exist until Good is gone but it is everly waiting for good to leave.
God had told us to do Good, and as long as we do good, evil does not exist in our lives. When we cease to do good, then evil is present in our lives.

As long as Adam and Eve did not eat of the tree then evil was not present with them, when they eat then evil become present in their lives.

 

john says

That is true to, but arminians never recieved the true gospel in the first place, so its still a false doctrine.

Do you take opportunity on other forums like for muslims ? God may have elect in those too. Jesus said

mk 6 11And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear you, when ye depart thence, shake off the dust under your feet for a testimony against them. Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

Here is a principle you do not follow. It is evident bob and the boys reject the gospel of grace.

Also titus 10A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

either you are disobediant to this principle or you believe armianism , a doctrine of christ that denys salvation by grace, as the bible teaches it , is not heresy. Salvation by grace john is a major bible doctrine ! To deny salvation by grace is no better than denying the virgin birth or the deity of christ.

There are plenty of opportunities to get the word out, thank god for the internet. But you have not the courage to call these people heretics, but you would not hesitate to call a muslim a heretic, a double standard. You say we are not to judge doctrine, but you will judge a jehovah witness uncinverted because of their doctrine, thats inconsistency john.

How can you tell the holy spirit has worked on a person whose testimony denies salvation by grace ? Thats crazy. The Holy spirit reveals christ and applies the work of christ to the elect !

Jn 16

13Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

[/B] 15All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

how can a person be worked on by God the Holy spirit and not understand salvation by grace ? John you are showing me that you interject a lot of humanism in your thinking sir. This promise is to the church, the bride of christ.

john, god has used you to make some good points, but I can percieve that you really do not believe that arminanism is a false gospel and a cult like mormonism, if you do not believe that, then you are not a true believer, in fact you are worser to me than bob and them, because you sin against more light...:tonofbricks:

if you believe those who profess armininism are believers, then for the gospel sake, you become my enemie....

 

That does not prove God did not create evil, in fact evil is good when it accomplishes Gods purpose.

Gen 50

20But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive.

:laugh:

 

All that God "created" was done in six days. After that there was no "creation."
After the fall, the Bible says that "by one man sin entered into the wold and death by sin, so that all have sinned."
It is obvious that Adam rebelled against God, by his own free will and thus sin entered into the world. We choose to sin. No one forces us to sin. All of the blasphemous statements that you wrote on this board you chose to write out of your depraved heart. Don't attribute it to God, or any one else. It was your choice and has nothing to do with election or sovereignty. The demeaninng things that you have posted, false accusation, character assassinations, the attack of people's salvations, all have been your choice. They are ungodly hate-filled statements. The Bible defines such hatred as murder. That is a serious sin.

Evil results from sin. Most evil in this world is a direct result in one way or another from sin. Even the sunamis, earthquakes, and the consequences that come from them are a result in part of sin. God judges sin in his own way. He also uses such circumstantial events to bring about salvation in the lives of others. He works all things to His own God. The Bible says:

"The wrath of man will praise Him." But man's wrath is chosen not forced upon him.

 

repent and believe the gospel, and the only way you can is if God gives you the will to. You are not a christian...satan has decieved you and you are bound for a christless eternity if God has not chosen you...:tonofbricks:

 

I am not deceived at all. From what you have posted thus far, I don't believe you can define the gospel using the Bible only. If I am to repent and believe the gospel, I want you to:
#1 Define repentance for me.
@2 Define the gospel for me.

Define these terms using the Bible only. you may not use a man's system of theology. It is the Bible wherein Jesus Christ is revealed. So tell me how I can be saved using the Bible only?

 

Secondly, prove to me beyond any shadow of a doubt that God has chosen you as one of His elect. How can you have any assurance of this.

 

bob says, you ain't my brother

question for you bob. In the exodous narrative, when God told pharoah to let my people go, did God want pharoah to let His people go ? or did he want him to sin by not letting them go ?

exodous 4 21And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

16And thou shalt say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath sent me unto thee, saying, Let my people go, that they may serve me in the wilderness: and, behold, hitherto thou wouldest not hear.

 

One doesn't need the full doctrine to be saved, that's works. Come to me Jesus said beloved.

I don't answer to you. :)

What I believe or not you cannot know unless I tell you and I have said nothing about other groups yet you tell me and the rest that you know what I believe.
I am glad you consider yourself my enemy. Now you will have to love me which is more than you have up to now. Matt 5:44 But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you...

john.

 

Arminius was a man like the rest of us who had his own failings. You're not saying he was perfect are you Bob boy?

You don'. Why does God create people He knows are going to Hell, love doesn't do that?

You said: Then God created this world and sinless people
So the word 'world' does not mean all men Bob. :)

john.

 

Good line John. I shall file this away and use it when needed. On somedays I could use it all day long.

Thanks John. :)

 

At least I seem more resonable now James. :) I've become a moderate Calvinist (unsaved). Haha!

I am finding it difficult to resolve the conflicting message coming out. God is first cause and anger aimed at men for what they believe is confusing. The two oppose each other.

I wonder? "Why does beloved still blame us for who resists God's will?" :)

john.

 

He won't anymore, John. He's been banned for his personal attacks on other posters...

 

Is it possible that "Arminius" and "Beloved57" were the same person? I think it was the same deluded person.

 

Well Arminius was definitely Armenian and beloved was hyper-calvinist.

So unless he was arguing with himself, they're two separate people...

 

They were opposite extremes, and they both had the same M.O. Someone well-versed in both opinions could easily inflame each side for some demented "fun", starting a fight and watching the blood fly. Come to think of it, I might try that myself someday!

 

JohnP looks at that and says that "WORLD" just means "the pre-fall world prior to Adam" when we read things like "God so Love the WORLD that HE gave".

But when you read that list above - do you really see a good excuse for gaming the point in that way?

I think not.

In the beginning God created the WORLD -- and then added people to IT. No problem understanding that point.

"God so Loved the WORLD that He gave" can not be twisted into "God so loved the arbitrarily selected FEW of Matt 7 that HE gave"... it just can not be done.

In Christ,

Bob

 

On this point we can both agree.

In Christ,

Bob

 

God is the author of Good for He is Good.

3Jo 1:11Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.

 

DHK:

"Secondly, prove to me beyond any shadow of a doubt that God has chosen you as one of His elect. How can you have any assurance of this."

GE:

Your question reveals the heart of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. The answer can be given by Grace only, namely "By faith only!" It goes beyond a shadow of doubt!